Hey Joe – Where are you going with that survey?
- 27 May, 2010 11:27
- Comments 33
“Yeah, I'd like, look, I, I, I try to be as fair dinkum and as honest as I can be.”
Those were the now famous words of shadow treasurer, Joe Hockey on the ABC’s 7.30 Report in response to claims of media manipulation the night after he gave his budget reply at the National Press Club.
So it with interest that I received a letter from Joe, my local federal member, which appeared to be asking me my thoughts on matters of national significance.
It was to my dismay that after fully reading the letter from Joe, it was apparent it was nothing more than a dodgy "local issues" survey attempting to cynically mislead his own North Sydney constituents on issues ranging from debt, tax, and education to the NBN, the Internet and health.
Now, while you would expect most politicians to put some kind of spin on issues when they can get away with it, the survey is nothing but a blatant attempt to skew the results in favour of his apparent policy positioning.
Take for example these questions on the NBN, which we now know the Opposition wants to axe:
“Has the Rudd Labor Government’s promised National Broadband Network been delivered in your area?”
And:
“Are you concerned that the National Broadband Network may cost up to $200 per month to use?”
In both situations respondents can tick a ‘Yes’, ‘No’, or ‘Don’t know’ check box. But that’s it. No other questions. No other context.
While those who have followed the NBN already know how ridiculous these questions are, the problem is there is a swathe of the general population that haven’t heard of the plan or read up on the issues involved.
Not asking them to begin with if they are familiar with the issues involved or even if they think the area would need better telecommunications infrastructure in the future is irresponsible – regardless of whether you like the NBN plan or not.
Then there is the question on the Internet:
“Do you support the Federal Government’s proposal to filter the internet?”
No mention that the Opposition also supports this plan and that there is a surging body of evidence that it is an ill-informed idea.
And another ICT-related one:
“Has the election promise of a laptop for every child been delivered in your area?”
Again, no mention that the Opposition is going to cut this plan and even if you answered, ‘No’, that wouldn’t change if the government did in the Federal election this year.
The same kind of misleading questions are evident on most of the issues Hockey presents and it is clearly aimed at colouring the views of respondents.
So you have to ask yourself, is Hockey merely trying to prop up his and his party’s position on these issues?
Is it really going to provide him with the facts needed to make an informed decision?
One of Hockey’s responsibilities – and is incumbent on every elected representative across Australia - is to provide constituents with all the information he possibly can and to gather in the most objective way possible as much evidence as he can to serve them through policy making and trying to get it through parliament – not merely pursuing opposition for opposition’s sake.
You can’t make informed decisions on uninformed facts.
And deliberately trying to skew a “local issues” survey in this manner is repulsive and not befitting a member of our parliament. Indeed, it is potentially damaging not just to the ICT industry with the questions I’ve pulled out above, but across the economy.
So much for fact-based policies and trying to be “fair-dinkum”.
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Comments
Dave
I have some respect for some policticians on both sides, but Joe is a complete tool who is unfit to run a national party raffle, he is right up there with S Conroy for Snake oil and bulldust.
Legaly have to vote come the election, but I wish there was a no one option, because both main parties are so off into LALA land and both extreme in their stupidity.
That said a couple of Greens MP,s have been quoted and caught on tape actualy using common sense, so the world has in fact gone mad.
Sean
Since when does the Opposition support the Internet censorship plan? Last time I heard, they liked the intentions, but believed that the plan was too flawed to work.
Eddie
"No mention that the Opposition also supports this plan"
Where'd you get that info? The Opposition are fence-sitting at the moment, and a few of them have actually spoken out against the idea, Hockey being one of them.
hak
Well if someone from the green is actually making sense we are all doomed.
I think I might actually be considering voting green this time round.
Considering that abbotts belief is that in opposition you should oppose all bills/plans out forward the fact they do not publicly oppose the net censorship is understandably taking as quiet backing.
They are just too scared to actually commit to either side in case they could score some short term political points.
A net filter of some sort is bound to come in, unlike the stimulus packages to help with the GFC the LNP wont oppose it as they are more right wing now than they ever have been and it sits in nicely with their developing policies.
It was only a couple of years ago when we had the line come out about "have one for yourself, one for your wife and one for the country" as justification of the baby bonus...now in a matter of a few years we suddenly have to put a halt to population growth and doing our part by accepting immigrants and asylum seekers..
Its amusing that they talk about political flip flopping...just look back at the inconsistancies they have touted, A couple of pearlers..."GST?...Never Ever", "No new taxes"..except the one on businesses to try to fund a materntity leave scheme so as not to be outdone by labour.
For fraser to turn his back and leave the party I think says a lot for where they are headed...might as well just drop the liberal part and just call yourselves the NAtional PArty...thats where their current policies align...or given the most recent announcement about sending back boats perhaps the One National PArty would be more appropriate.
Trevor Clarke
@Sean & @Eddie - Thanks you are absolutely right and I was wrong. I still think Joe should have mentioned they haven't committed to scrapping it and are "consulting" with the telco industry. The following is from Tony Smith:
"The Coalition is yet to be convinced that mandatory filtering will be effective.
"The Coalition would like an independent audit of the trial results and we hope this can happen as soon as possible.
"The Coalition will continue to consult extensively with the telecommunications industry and other stakeholders to enable a fully informed response, if and when the Government puts forward any formal proposal or legislation."
Regards
Bob
Even by simply asking “Has the Rudd Labor Government’s promised National Broadband Network been delivered in your area?”, Hockey has given a free plug to Labour's NBN policy, which has achieved some of the highest takeup rates in the world (More than *16%* in Point Cook) since its rollout.
Takeup rates for other countries
Sweden = 6%
Japan = 7%
North Korea = 8%
US = 12%
Laszlo Panaflex
To Sean, Eddie, and anyone else reading - the Liberal Party haven't confirmed or denied support for the ISP filter in its current format, but have expressed support for the concept of ISP filtering. They fully support the idea, but don't want to be seen saying "Labor are doing exactly what we would do." If you don't like censorship, unfortunately there's no major party you can vote for. The Greens I suppose, but they aren't about to win.
Ads
"Do you support the Federal Government’s proposal to filter the internet?”
No mention that the Opposition also supports this plan"
The opposition have said nothing of the sort. They support PC based filters that concerned parents can install for free. They looked at a plan similar to Conroy while in government and threw it out.
Please get this right - they are our only hope of not having a filter at all
Trevor Clarke
@Ads - please see my earlier comment
Eddie
@Laszlo -- you might be correct, but bear this in mind: if the Libs really wanted a mandatory filter in place they could have done so when they had HoR and Senate majority a few years back, but they didn't. Instead, they nixed the idea.
Gerryod
So if Phoney Tony, Sloppy Joe and Barnaby Goose get their hands on things we wont have to worry about filtering, because the whole thing will grind to a halt in any case - how about the fact that Australia will be behind Mongolia for Internet accessability - roll back the NBN - what a great policy, boys!
Michael
Hi Trevor - Where you going with this article? Yeah, okay, okay. I get it. You don’t like Joe Hockey. Alright.
You say that he was doing “dodgy” misleading with his questionnaire “on issues ranging from debt, tax, and education to the NBN, the Internet and health“. Then in your editorial you only wrote about a few of these items that you listed as “dodgy”:
NBN: Joe says that it “may” cost up to $200 a month to use. Well I think that the householder will be charged much the same as they are now by their ISP. But the taxpayer, well that’s another story. Now lets see....If we take $40ish billion and divide by 11ish million taxpayers ...hmmmmm.
Laptops for Every Child: Labour made a promise to give one PC to every secondary student in years 9 to 12 by 2011. On Q&A Kevin Rudd seemed to recall that they said 2013. He claimed to have about 260,000 computers in schools now. He said “It’s a fact”.
And if you believe that range of around 150,000 computers that were actually dispersed is close enough to be in the PM’s “about” range of 260,000 then then his “fact” is accurate.
So really not a bad question. Pretty easy question I would have thought. Either your kid got one or they didn’t. Not too sure how this is misleading.
Filtering the Internet: You stated that the Libs support it. Then retracted it later. Okay. Fair enough. Although a bit dodgy I'd say.
I am looking forward to read what issues you have with Hockey’s questions on debt, taxes and health.
Daniel
Michael, how can say X about labor, but not say it for Liberal? both parties should be held accountable for what they announce, say, and do and do not.
The fact remains the NBN is progressing, and trials are going good.
Abbott has made fair share of mistakes (including todays effort) as well as Julia Bishop security mess.
This is Election year, and Liberals are trying to do everything to get back in.
The NBN (and related) is a good policy, and it is following what the world is doing.
PeterA
Sorry Michael,
You seem to have missed the point.
A policy, whose objectives and timeline state will take 8 years (or another 1 year in the case of the laptop one) to complete, and Joe Hockey clearly knows that northern Sydney (or wherever) haven't completed their roll out of the NBN, and he asks: "Have you got yours yet?" Likewise with the laptop scheme.
Sure, Rudd might not be across the numbers (and arguably he should be) but the scheme isn't over yet!
And I love how you completely gloss over the NBN question, as if it never existed, and this article was a complete waste of time.
Give me a break.
PPS.
40 billion divided by 11 million divided by 8 years divided by 12 months = 37 dollars.
What's your point?
Also, wasn't it going to be 50% funded by non-government?
And wasn't it going to make a profit of 6%pa?? Arguably a slow return on investment, but with great benefits in increased company efficiency = increased profits = more tax revenue = indirect benefits to the government and all Australian citizens)
Michael, I don't see the problem.
Simmo
How about we process all Internet traffic off shore by turning it around and sending it back if it comes by sea, but allow 100 times that amount to come in via air without any mention. Sorry, have I confused Joe's policies?
Chris B
Sorry Peter but the government should be held accountable for the plethora of promises made pre-election and their dismal ability to actually deliver any of them...
The NBN is just one one of these promises with absolutely no business plan, figures plucked from the air / a $26 million dollar report that apparently had another 2 months worth of tweaking at the bargain price of $2 million before it saw the light of day. Have you researched what the experts in the telecommunications field think about the figures? If you had you would know that they are out by a long stretch. The ROI is apparently for private sector investment. But who in their right mind would invest in this rather than placing their money into 100% secure term deposits that return more?
Any mention on the complete sale of the NBN within 5 years of completion being part of the governments plans either? Guess not.
To be honest I'm over the 'we need superfast broadband at any cost' view that is being spouted around and wish people would wake up and smell the coffee.
Asmo
The government and the opposition are as bad as each other.
Loaded and spun survey's are nothing new, like the old "Do you think the government should stop child pornography?"question being used as a basis for support for the internet filter.
Regardless of whether the NBN is achievable or not (I don't think Labor has proved that it's capable of delivering a packed lunch let alone a network with overly optimistic take up rates), pollies should tell the whole story and try to educate the community rather than relying on slanted polls designed to garner exactly the response they want to hear.
Daniel
Asmo, The Point Cook trial already has a 20% uptake.
Just Adam
Well, we might have to vote for the Pirate Party. They are against the filter. Not sure which way they are leaning with the NBN.
NBN - go - go faster - now now now
Filtering - kill it
Jesse
Got the same survey (those questions were identical anyway) in Cook - guessing all (coalition?) electorates got it or something similar.
Tim
Yeah, got the same survey in Adelaide Hills, SA. Heaps dodgy/implied bias in sooo many of these questions. As a graduate with a statistics major, I hated reading it.
RS
Being a swinging voter, I like to weigh up the pros and cons of each major party.
For example Labor - I would like the NBN but not a mandatory filter. Hmmm.
Libs I'm not too clear on their policies and believe they are being coy on a number of issues.
However I heard just a few days ago, that their elder statesman Malcolm Fraser actually quit the party because he believes they are now too conservatively extreme to be a Liberal party.
So if a former Liberal PM has abandoned them, I think the alarm bells should be ringing for the rest of us, who actually think before they vote!
???
Yep. Same Survey in Sophie Mirabella's electorate (Indi).
Bob
With a startup takeup rate of 20%, the Point Cook trial has already achieved an annual takeup rate that is 40-300% higher than countries that have already deployed National Fibre networks like the NBN. Even the new UK conservative party is rolling out a fibre NBN. The Tasmanian Liberal party supported the NBN rollout in their own state.
When is Joe Hockey going to wakeup and provide bipartisan support to the NBN ?
Juff
Hilarious.
This reminds me of when i was 10years old and i was on the debating team arguing that "homework should be compulsory for all students".
I did a survey of my classmates asking them whether they felt it was important to learn discipline in work so that they could be successful in the future.
of course everyone responded "yes"
being the bastard that i was i manipulated these responses into my own words and claimed that this data therefore meant that my whole class was in favour of homework.
My teacher subsequently blasted me for this manipulation and got quite angry.
Just to repeat - i was 10 years old.
how old is Joe Hockey?
SkidMarx
Ahhhhh, politicians. Don't you just love them...?
What you all need to remember of course, is that the only, mandatory qualification required, to become a successful politician, is their own innate ability to beat all other contenders, in their races to the top of their respective, political pond SCUM...!!!
Whatever made you think that they are in it, for YOUR benefit...???
TB
Dave, there is a "no one" option - it's called submitting a blank ballot, which is precisely what I plan on doing in the next election. If the Pirate Party run a candidate in my electorate I *might* consider throwing my vote their way as a symbolic gesture, but as far as I'm concerned, politics is a failure.
peterh_oz
Hmmm .. Surveys 101 according to Sir Humphrey Appleby:
Humphrey: You know what happens: nice young lady comes up to you. Obviously you want to create a good impression, you don't want to look a fool, do you? So she starts asking you some questions: "Mr. Woolley, are you worried about the number of young people without jobs?"
Bernard: Yes
Humphrey: "Are you worried about the rise in crime among teenagers?"
Bernard: Yes
Humphrey: "Do you think there is a lack of discipline in our Comprehensive schools?"
Bernard: Yes
Humphrey: "Do you think young people welcome some authority and leadership in their lives?"
Bernard: Yes
Humphrey: "Do you think they respond to a challenge?"
Bernard: Yes
Humphrey: "Would you be in favour of reintroducing National Service?"
Bernard: Oh...well, I suppose I might be.
Humphrey: "Yes or no?"
Bernard: Yes
Humphrey: Of course you would, Bernard. After all you told her you can't say no to that. So they don't mention the first five questions and they publish the last one.
Bernard: Is that really what they do?
Humphrey: Well, not the reputable ones no, but there aren't many of those. So alternatively the young lady can get the opposite result.
Bernard: How?
Humphrey: "Mr. Woolley, are you worried about the danger of war?"
Bernard: Yes
Humphrey: "Are you worried about the growth of armaments?"
Bernard: Yes
Humphrey: "Do you think there is a danger in giving young people guns and teaching them how to kill?"
Bernard: Yes
Humphrey: "Do you think it is wrong to force people to take up arms against their will?"
Bernard: Yes
Humphrey: "Would you oppose the reintroduction of National Service?"
Bernard: Yes
Humphrey: There you are, you see Bernard. The perfect balanced sample.
Listen to it here:
http://www.yes-minister.com/sounds/ypm12q1.ram
Realist
LOL this survey is being sent out all over the country. The only things that are different are the pictures and the return address.
Igster
agree with realist, I got the same survey from my lib rep a few months ago, it's push-polling, they don't care about ppls responses, they just want implant ideas in ppl minds
Caroline
Yes, I just filled out the same survey. There were also some brilliant questions about "Rudd's massive debt" and the thoughtful, Is the Fed Govt doing enough to promote alternative solutions to tackle climate change, or is it too focused on raising a new tax?
What is the point of asking whether the NBN has been delivered to me yet? Shouldn't Joe know this about his electorate? And long term infrastructure has to be built first??? I don't know whether I am concerned that it could cost UP TO $200 per month. Who is getting charged $200? What will the average household have to pay? I am more concerned about knowing how much it WILL cost, and how much it will cost ME.
My favourite part has to be the colour photo of Tony Abbott at a hospital. Good thing to know they are making good use of their printing and communication entitlements to gauge and show respect for the concerns of their local constituents.
Jay
I'm unsure where you're getting 11 million households in Australia. The true figure is closer to 7.5 million households and the calculations assume a 100% take-up of the NBN by all households. This assumption also seems to indicate the complete withdrawal from the broadband market by Telstra and other big players, giving a complete monopolisation of the market to NBN. Has anyone really thought this project through to post implementation. After spending many years working as an analyst in canberra on Government IT projects, I would have to say "No".
Dave
Err Jay, the NBN supplies the pipe, private companies then resell to the household, if you were working 'AS' an analyst, I can see why you are not now.
TELSTA and all the rest will all be operating as normal, paying a fixed fee, to then resell as whatever package they wish.
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